Paying respects for Chinese New Year: pai2 ni5 / pai1 cia~1

Sim · Post by **Sim** » Wed Sep 07, 2005 12:00 pm

Hi all!

I met a new guy in Amsterdam. He’s from Taiwan and very interested in Hokkien language. I was speaking to him about Chinese New Year, and told him how in Malaysia we went to "pai1 cia~1" every New Year wearing new clothes (of course, he knew this, as all Chinese do this).

However, he was initially very puzzled by the phrase "pai1 cia~1" which I used to describe the New Year visits. He said that the words he used were "pai2 ni5" (which of course matches Mandarin "bai4 nian2"), and that he had never heard of this word "cia~1". [Also, of course, Penang Hokkien sandhi has "pai3" -> "pai1" instead of the usual "pai3" -> "pai2".]

After a bit of thinking, he decided that this word "cia~1" was the same word as in "cia~7 gueh8", the first month of the lunar calendar (which made sense to me). He said it corresponded to the Mandarin word "zhen" (but I forgot the tone he used).

He also said that this was (from a Taiwanese point of view) an archaic way of saying "pai2 ni5".

Could anyone here confirm that this is correct, and can anyone give the Chinese character for "zhen"/'cia~"?

Thanks,

Sim.

hong · Post by **hong** » Wed Sep 07, 2005 12:30 pm

we don't have to buy those costly dict to confirm this .A 10 pounds xiamen dict from china already give 拜正。
The sandhi you said of 3 to 1 could be from chuanchiu sects
泉州市 and 晉江 yingqu 41-55 or to be more correct 31 to 55 of 南安。

hong · Post by **hong** » Wed Sep 07, 2005 12:56 pm

In other book yingqu of chuanchiu sects is just 31.I think people take 21 from xia/ciang.I am glad I speak this sandhi correct in 南安 way.I only have to worry about other sandhi and rising entering tones instead of a short version.

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Wed Sep 07, 2005 3:01 pm

正: zheng4 in Mandarin.
Since it's Yin Qu tone -> chia~3 in Hokkien

Sim · Post by **Sim** » Wed Sep 07, 2005 4:01 pm

Hong & Guest,

Thanks very much

.

Sim.

hong · Post by **hong** » Wed Sep 07, 2005 4:05 pm

It is first tone.The trouble is some sects has rising tone for this tone.

Andrew · Post by **Andrew** » Wed Sep 07, 2005 4:44 pm

It is also part of the usual Hokkien expression for Chinese New Year, 新正, sin1-cia~1

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Wed Sep 07, 2005 4:48 pm

Andrew wrote:It is also part of the usual Hokkien expression for Chinese New Year, 新正, sin1-cia~1

Hi Andrew,

That was exactly my point... for me, this was the most normal expression for the New Year, but this new Taiwanese friend said that it was very archaic, and that the normal Taiwaneese way of saying it was "sin ni" (but perhaps that is Mandarin influence from the Mainlanders on Taiwan).

Cheers,
Sim.

Sim · Post by **Sim** » Wed Sep 07, 2005 4:53 pm

Anonymous wrote:
Andrew wrote:It is also part of the usual Hokkien expression for Chinese New Year, 新正, sin1-cia~1
Hi Andrew,

That was exactly my point... for me, this was the most normal expression for the New Year, but this new Taiwanese friend said that it was very archaic, and that the normal Taiwaneese way of saying it was "sin ni" (but perhaps that is Mandarin influence from the Mainlanders on Taiwan).

Cheers,
Sim.

Andrew,

Oops, sorry! I didn't read your reply carefully enough... Indeed, you introduced the expression "sin cia~", and my initial posting was "pai cia~".

My apologies!

I shall ask him what the status of "sin cia~" is in Taiwan.

Sim.

hong · Post by **hong** » Thu Sep 08, 2005 12:15 am

people from taiwan use mandarin word which are not used in china .Example they like to wan完 -做完，买完 instead of usual 了。
新正 is used widely in taiwan and also teochew in china
http://taiwantt.org.tw/news/2005/20050220-0/0220-0.htm
新正将至 The new year is coming
www.lukang.gov.tw/title-4/year/01.htm 初一开正