Hi! I have just read all the postings you guys discussing about monkey. I am very much impressed by your hard working in making clear the Chinese words especially as foreigners you are.
(I don’t know English well, hope you understand what I’m saying)
The word monkey is 猴 (hau6) which has a more ancient writing as箟 with a radical character犬, Cantonese phonetic symbol is (hau1). Actually 猴 should be pronounced as (hau1) but it has changed during practical uses as ages passed by. Sound changes including tones are very common and it creates sound differences between ancient and modern words. Thus, the character猴 has been widely accepted and defined as hau6 in dictionaries. However, its ancient sound is still kept in the colloquial usage of Cantonese native speakers despite most of them do not know what is the character it indicates.
Now 馬騮, 馬留 are the wrong assertion made by the public in order to match the sound (maa5 lau1). Certainly monkey has nothing to do with a horse. The correct characters for monkey are 獼猴mei4 hau6 which always come together as a word for monkey in most Chinese Dictionaries. The first character has experienced a sound change and it had once been pronounced as 馬maa5 and then changed to be maa1. It meant female monkey originally but as per widely used and implied, it appeared to mean all female animals afterwards. Nowadays, the character “mother 媽” (maa1) is also originated from 獼. According to the customary sound change in Cantonese i.e. the consonant of the first character and the vowel of the second will usually remain unchanged while the rest changes, “h” is always omitted and substituted by “l” after the vowel “aa”. So it is justified that 猴 should be sounded as hau6 when comes alone while sounded as lau1 when comes together with 獼.maa5
For the reason that the word’s sound had changed and the word pertaining to the sound seemed to have lost, the ancient Chinese created new characters to match the sound, thus in the above case, 猱 (monkey) was created . The phonetic symbol for this word is naau4 in dictionaries but in colloquial usage it pronounces as lau4 or lau1. Therefore, the word monkey should be re-defined as 獼猱 using maa5 lau1 as its citing sound and maa1 lau1 could be accepted as its colloquial sound.
By the way, let’s talk about another puzzled word “to sleep” 睏。Many Chinese dictionaries has the entry of 睏 whose original meaning is tiresome of eyes thus implies as sleepy; when using as a verb it means to sleep. Because of the different usage between Mandarin and Cantonese, the former use 睡 (shui4) to express “to sleep” while the latter use it to mean napping/ to take a nap e.g. 食飽睡一睡，好過做元帥 (means “to have a nap after having a meal is better than being an admiral” where the first 睡is a verb the second is a noun). The Cantonese has used 睏 to mean “ sleep” for very long time as early as from Ming Dynasty. Some old dictionaries has recorded this usage as the only meaning that 睏 carried。 As to the pronunciation, it was recorded as kwan3. However it should be read as fan3. As to the fact that there was no consonant “f” before Tang Dynasty, sounds of words changed during and after Tang, “f” was taken to replace some other consonants. There was no strict rules but customary. Here are some examples : 1. p. b → f, 2. gw, hw, kw →f.
For 1. 埠 bou6* →fau6,
浮 pou4→fau4*
For 2. 揮 gwan1 →fai1 / fik9(6) / fing6,
揈 gwang1*→ fang4
歡 hwan1→fun1*
虎 hwu3→fu2*
苦 kwu3→fu2*
寬 kwan1→fun1*
* = present sound marked in common dictionaries
The phonetic symbols for 睏in the dictionaries are obviously wrong and should be modified or re-defined to be fan3. P.S. 目訓 is created by Hongkongese to match the sound. There is totally not such word in Chinese at present, but if 睏’s right sound continues to be veiled, 目訓 may possibly be put into dictionary someday and thus added to the accumulated 50,000 words of Chinese characters. Then the Chinese gets more to memorize and takes longer to learn just for redundant words. The willful creation of Chinese words by the Chinese has done enough to ruin the Chinese culture, Please stop it.
To: Kobo-Daishi & Thomas
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Kobo-Daishi
Re: To: Kobo-Daishi & Thomas
Dear Terence,
This is all very interesting. Where did you get all this information? Did you get it from an etymological dictionary of the Cantonese dialect? Are you in Guangdong province?
Also, what is the character that follows this passage in your posting “The word monkey is 猴 (hau6) which has a more ancient writing as…”? My browser shows a blank square after this part? Or was this a typo.
Kobo-Daishi, PLLA.
This is all very interesting. Where did you get all this information? Did you get it from an etymological dictionary of the Cantonese dialect? Are you in Guangdong province?
Also, what is the character that follows this passage in your posting “The word monkey is 猴 (hau6) which has a more ancient writing as…”? My browser shows a blank square after this part? Or was this a typo.
Kobo-Daishi, PLLA.
-
Terence Lee
Re: To: Kobo-Daishi & Thomas
Dear Kobo-Daishi
I am in Hong Kong. The information I got for the previous posting was from some conventional and dialect scripts as well as historical books written by scholars in Mainland China. Some were made by my own studies in Guangzhouhua (Cantonese language)
It could be a long essay if detailing the trace of the word’s origin and I try to cut it short. According to various studies of Jiaguwen (Shang’s pictograph), there was a character written as a picture of a monkey, which was recognized as夔 (without two top dots ) in recent decades. (If you don’t see this character , try to get it from the name ‘Kui’ of the Three Gorges
Due to the fact that Zhou Dynasty and the dynasties after her did not solely and directly inherit the culture of Shang , 夔 was not known to be Shang’s monkey in the beginning. But monkey had a sound ‘hau1 or 4 or 6’ which exists even before characters were created. According to a commentator’s script on a newspaper in Anhui Province, (I read it during traveling there years ago but I forgot the title), that a sound homonym危 (巳 replaced by矢) was then taken to be a sound symbol for ‘hau4’ which combined with dog radical to represent monkey犬危, Then, monkey had its first character form. I think that perhaps during the standardization process of characters in late Qin or early Han Dynasty, the character犬危changed to be猴 (hau4). You can see both characters in the form of seal and regular character in the Analytical Dictionary of Characters
The original pictograph of monkey had later been recognized as夔but was deemed to be a kind of dog, but not later than Han, it was re-defined as a kind of monkey ( Tribal Custom of South China). The character had also changed to be # (no modern font, look like憂), and it was finally standardized as犬憂(憂was a part of the character then). 憂became a sound symbol pronounced as you1 in Pinyin, jau1 in Jyutpin too. It later developed as猱 (柔is deemed to be a simplified character of 憂) with the sound as nao2 in Pinyin, naau4 in Jyutpin but the meanings had largely been expanded, beside ‘a kind of monkey’, it also means to paint( I guess it is the original character of painting wall 髹jau4), to play musical instruments, movement as prompt as monkey , to group and tangle together (I guess it is the original character for 烏蠅 lau1馬尾，一拍兩散) etc.
Some scholars’ scripts written in Ming and Qing Dynasties had indicated that 夔 was an ancient sacred monkey, some said that 犬憂 was a kind of ape, the other said that 猱 was an animal that looked like monkey etc. This implies that no one knew exactly what the characters indicated in their time.
But luckily we now know that 夔 , 犬憂 , 猱 are the same, at least, they are widely agreed by dictionaries. Since some scholars has found out 夔 is also the original character of 猴, though they could be of different kinds, I still insist that the modern dictionaries should rectify the entry of monkey from 馬騮to獼猴 maa5 hau4 or 獼猱 maa5 naau4(lau1). Since 猴 would only be sounded as lau1 following 獼，(not to repeat the sound change) I would like to see 獼猱 as the word for the colloquial sound maa5lau1.
P.S. There has not a book clearly stated the above evolution of characters. I did it basing on my own study and deduction. However, whether you will agree or not, I do think that Scholars’ writings are not precept, sometimes we do need to have our own inference as long as it is supported by firm materials. Moreover, not all the above information is based on well-known books but materials and leads are found in various fields of scripts. Part of the materials of 獼 and 獶could be found in Kangxi Zi Dian, Analytical Dictionary of Characters, Han Zi Xue, Han Yu Da Ci Dian, Ancient Han Language Study and Tribal Custom of South China.
More information about 睏: I am not sure about how kwan3 has changed to fan3. All I can be sure is that 睏 is the character of ‘to sleep , to lie down (see Ci Jyun and Xiandai Hanyu Cidian). Apart from the possibility that consonants kw and hw commonly replaced by f, the customary sound change could take place due to avoiding things bad and it is quite often for the Cantonese to change the original sound to avoid taboo, like these: chopsticks 箸 (sound as 住 ‘stop, be held up’) changes to be 筷(same sound as ‘快 going fast’)，liver 肝(same sound as 乾 ‘dry, less money’) changes to be 潤 'wet, benefit’; tongue 舌(sound similar to ' 蝕 lost money’) changes to 利 ‘benefit’ ; and all foul language such as the words 鳩、溝、勾(gau1) have all been changed to be kau1 or ngau1 so as not to speak foul language as man’s dick had the sound gau1. Since kwan3 had the same sound as 困 which means ‘in a harsh situation' , it is justified that the Cantonese will not utter this sound in order to have a nice sleep. Will you agree with the above inference?
I am in Hong Kong. The information I got for the previous posting was from some conventional and dialect scripts as well as historical books written by scholars in Mainland China. Some were made by my own studies in Guangzhouhua (Cantonese language)
It could be a long essay if detailing the trace of the word’s origin and I try to cut it short. According to various studies of Jiaguwen (Shang’s pictograph), there was a character written as a picture of a monkey, which was recognized as夔 (without two top dots ) in recent decades. (If you don’t see this character , try to get it from the name ‘Kui’ of the Three Gorges
Due to the fact that Zhou Dynasty and the dynasties after her did not solely and directly inherit the culture of Shang , 夔 was not known to be Shang’s monkey in the beginning. But monkey had a sound ‘hau1 or 4 or 6’ which exists even before characters were created. According to a commentator’s script on a newspaper in Anhui Province, (I read it during traveling there years ago but I forgot the title), that a sound homonym危 (巳 replaced by矢) was then taken to be a sound symbol for ‘hau4’ which combined with dog radical to represent monkey犬危, Then, monkey had its first character form. I think that perhaps during the standardization process of characters in late Qin or early Han Dynasty, the character犬危changed to be猴 (hau4). You can see both characters in the form of seal and regular character in the Analytical Dictionary of Characters
The original pictograph of monkey had later been recognized as夔but was deemed to be a kind of dog, but not later than Han, it was re-defined as a kind of monkey ( Tribal Custom of South China). The character had also changed to be # (no modern font, look like憂), and it was finally standardized as犬憂(憂was a part of the character then). 憂became a sound symbol pronounced as you1 in Pinyin, jau1 in Jyutpin too. It later developed as猱 (柔is deemed to be a simplified character of 憂) with the sound as nao2 in Pinyin, naau4 in Jyutpin but the meanings had largely been expanded, beside ‘a kind of monkey’, it also means to paint( I guess it is the original character of painting wall 髹jau4), to play musical instruments, movement as prompt as monkey , to group and tangle together (I guess it is the original character for 烏蠅 lau1馬尾，一拍兩散) etc.
Some scholars’ scripts written in Ming and Qing Dynasties had indicated that 夔 was an ancient sacred monkey, some said that 犬憂 was a kind of ape, the other said that 猱 was an animal that looked like monkey etc. This implies that no one knew exactly what the characters indicated in their time.
But luckily we now know that 夔 , 犬憂 , 猱 are the same, at least, they are widely agreed by dictionaries. Since some scholars has found out 夔 is also the original character of 猴, though they could be of different kinds, I still insist that the modern dictionaries should rectify the entry of monkey from 馬騮to獼猴 maa5 hau4 or 獼猱 maa5 naau4(lau1). Since 猴 would only be sounded as lau1 following 獼，(not to repeat the sound change) I would like to see 獼猱 as the word for the colloquial sound maa5lau1.
P.S. There has not a book clearly stated the above evolution of characters. I did it basing on my own study and deduction. However, whether you will agree or not, I do think that Scholars’ writings are not precept, sometimes we do need to have our own inference as long as it is supported by firm materials. Moreover, not all the above information is based on well-known books but materials and leads are found in various fields of scripts. Part of the materials of 獼 and 獶could be found in Kangxi Zi Dian, Analytical Dictionary of Characters, Han Zi Xue, Han Yu Da Ci Dian, Ancient Han Language Study and Tribal Custom of South China.
More information about 睏: I am not sure about how kwan3 has changed to fan3. All I can be sure is that 睏 is the character of ‘to sleep , to lie down (see Ci Jyun and Xiandai Hanyu Cidian). Apart from the possibility that consonants kw and hw commonly replaced by f, the customary sound change could take place due to avoiding things bad and it is quite often for the Cantonese to change the original sound to avoid taboo, like these: chopsticks 箸 (sound as 住 ‘stop, be held up’) changes to be 筷(same sound as ‘快 going fast’)，liver 肝(same sound as 乾 ‘dry, less money’) changes to be 潤 'wet, benefit’; tongue 舌(sound similar to ' 蝕 lost money’) changes to 利 ‘benefit’ ; and all foul language such as the words 鳩、溝、勾(gau1) have all been changed to be kau1 or ngau1 so as not to speak foul language as man’s dick had the sound gau1. Since kwan3 had the same sound as 困 which means ‘in a harsh situation' , it is justified that the Cantonese will not utter this sound in order to have a nice sleep. Will you agree with the above inference?
-
Thomas Chan
Re: To: Kobo-Daishi & Thomas
Terence Lee wrote:
>
> The correct characters for monkey
> are 獼猴mei4 hau6 which always come together as a word for
> monkey in most Chinese Dictionaries.
Thank you for your explanation, Terrence.
However, I have two questions below.
> The first character has
> experienced a sound change and it had once been pronounced as
> 馬maa5 and then changed to be maa1. It meant female monkey
> originally but as per widely used and implied, it appeared to
> mean all female animals afterwards. Nowadays, the character
> “mother 媽” (maa1) is also originated from 獼. According to
Do you think that word is also the source of
Cantonese ma4 {女麻} 'paternal
grandmother', Cantonese na2 {也母}
'female', and Hakka ma {女麻} 'female'?
> the customary sound change in Cantonese i.e. the consonant of
> the first character and the vowel of the second will usually
> remain unchanged while the rest changes, “h” is always
> omitted and substituted by “l” after the vowel “aa”. So
> it is justified that 猴 should be sounded as hau6 when comes
> alone while sounded as lau1 when comes together with 獼.
I'm not so convinced by this. I understand
how [h] can disappear, but how does [l]
come out of nowhere?
Thomas Chan
tc31@cornell.edu
>
> The correct characters for monkey
> are 獼猴mei4 hau6 which always come together as a word for
> monkey in most Chinese Dictionaries.
Thank you for your explanation, Terrence.
However, I have two questions below.
> The first character has
> experienced a sound change and it had once been pronounced as
> 馬maa5 and then changed to be maa1. It meant female monkey
> originally but as per widely used and implied, it appeared to
> mean all female animals afterwards. Nowadays, the character
> “mother 媽” (maa1) is also originated from 獼. According to
Do you think that word is also the source of
Cantonese ma4 {女麻} 'paternal
grandmother', Cantonese na2 {也母}
'female', and Hakka ma {女麻} 'female'?
> the customary sound change in Cantonese i.e. the consonant of
> the first character and the vowel of the second will usually
> remain unchanged while the rest changes, “h” is always
> omitted and substituted by “l” after the vowel “aa”. So
> it is justified that 猴 should be sounded as hau6 when comes
> alone while sounded as lau1 when comes together with 獼.
I'm not so convinced by this. I understand
how [h] can disappear, but how does [l]
come out of nowhere?
Thomas Chan
tc31@cornell.edu
-
Thomas Chan
Re: To: Kobo-Daishi & Thomas
Terence Lee wrote:
>
> More information about 睏: I am not sure about how kwan3 has
> changed to fan3. All I can be sure is that 睏 is the
> character of ‘to sleep , to lie down (see Ci Jyun and
> Xiandai Hanyu Cidian). Apart from the possibility that
> consonants kw and hw commonly replaced by f, the customary
> sound change could take place due to avoiding things bad and
> it is quite often for the Cantonese to change the original
> sound to avoid taboo, like these:
I've found 'to sleep' listed with an
alternate pronunciation, han3, in some
dictionaries, but I've never heard it.
However, that might serve as a link
between kwan3 and fan3.
Thomas Chan
tc31@cornell.edu
>
> More information about 睏: I am not sure about how kwan3 has
> changed to fan3. All I can be sure is that 睏 is the
> character of ‘to sleep , to lie down (see Ci Jyun and
> Xiandai Hanyu Cidian). Apart from the possibility that
> consonants kw and hw commonly replaced by f, the customary
> sound change could take place due to avoiding things bad and
> it is quite often for the Cantonese to change the original
> sound to avoid taboo, like these:
I've found 'to sleep' listed with an
alternate pronunciation, han3, in some
dictionaries, but I've never heard it.
However, that might serve as a link
between kwan3 and fan3.
Thomas Chan
tc31@cornell.edu
-
Thomas Chan
Re: To: Kobo-Daishi & Thomas
Thomas Chan wrote:
>
> Terence Lee wrote:
> >
> > The correct characters for monkey
> > are 獼猴mei4 hau6 which always come together as a word for
> > monkey in most Chinese Dictionaries.
>
> Thank you for your explanation, Terrence.
> However, I have two questions below.
Sorry about misspelling your name, Terence.
Thomas Chan
tc31@cornell.edu
>
> Terence Lee wrote:
> >
> > The correct characters for monkey
> > are 獼猴mei4 hau6 which always come together as a word for
> > monkey in most Chinese Dictionaries.
>
> Thank you for your explanation, Terrence.
> However, I have two questions below.
Sorry about misspelling your name, Terence.
Thomas Chan
tc31@cornell.edu
-
Terence Lee
Re: To: Kobo-Daishi & Thomas
Dear Thomas,
For your question 1, there is a small book probably called the Newly Found Origin of Chinese Civilization (大概是中華文明新探) published in Mainland China, the writer is from Yi Zu彝族. In the book, the writer revealed that maa1 媽is from maa5獼 but did not reveal that had relations with 女麻，or 也母. But another character 母也was mentioned coming along with 女矣 母也, it means old women. However, the word was also of a dialect. As to 也母, I remember that there was someone who had made detailed study on it but I forgot his conclusion. Maybe I can find it later. I know some modern dictionaries have made entry of this character to mean female but it is however, a dialect probably a product of another willful creation. I personally believe that the characters had relations with each other in some ways. Will 女麻 actually be 女麼or simply 媽as both bear the same sound and have meanings of old women except mother? Another book, namely Studies of Dialects and Slangs of Yue (百越方言…考) has this entries : Hakkas are from mountains of Jiangxi Province. They moved eastwards and then southwards to Canton and thus they carried many accents and dialects from other dialect areas. Another entry revealed that nowadays some Hakkas living near Guangzhou speaks Cantonese except some old addressing like calling blood-linked auntie as ‘moo’ (English phonetic symbol, not standard Cantonese sound), calling grand auntie (祖輩) as maa1. The character for the former, the writer took 姆，姥 to represent while for the latter he used 媽， 嬤. It seems that the writer was not quite sure what the characters should be and thus he gave two characters. I hope this information will be of some help to you.
For question 2, you are right . I did not do much consideration on why there is a relation substituting h with l. I just did it according to my memory about a book that had stated the substitution customs. As I have just started to study Guangzhouhua, though I have interested in it for a very long time, I had not made records about the books and scripts that I had read before. I remembered that the book’s name is somewhat about evolution of sounds of the minor races (可能是,兄弟民族語言演化概略). The writer of that book had given some examples that h will be replaced by l after long vowel copula. Now I cannot recall them and indeed, I personally have not found examples in my own language. I will go to retrieve that book and once I got it I’ll let you know. Although I admit there is not enough evidence for this inference, I still believe that hau4 has been turned to be lau1. Do you think that hau4 would possibly be influenced by 猱?
For your question 1, there is a small book probably called the Newly Found Origin of Chinese Civilization (大概是中華文明新探) published in Mainland China, the writer is from Yi Zu彝族. In the book, the writer revealed that maa1 媽is from maa5獼 but did not reveal that had relations with 女麻，or 也母. But another character 母也was mentioned coming along with 女矣 母也, it means old women. However, the word was also of a dialect. As to 也母, I remember that there was someone who had made detailed study on it but I forgot his conclusion. Maybe I can find it later. I know some modern dictionaries have made entry of this character to mean female but it is however, a dialect probably a product of another willful creation. I personally believe that the characters had relations with each other in some ways. Will 女麻 actually be 女麼or simply 媽as both bear the same sound and have meanings of old women except mother? Another book, namely Studies of Dialects and Slangs of Yue (百越方言…考) has this entries : Hakkas are from mountains of Jiangxi Province. They moved eastwards and then southwards to Canton and thus they carried many accents and dialects from other dialect areas. Another entry revealed that nowadays some Hakkas living near Guangzhou speaks Cantonese except some old addressing like calling blood-linked auntie as ‘moo’ (English phonetic symbol, not standard Cantonese sound), calling grand auntie (祖輩) as maa1. The character for the former, the writer took 姆，姥 to represent while for the latter he used 媽， 嬤. It seems that the writer was not quite sure what the characters should be and thus he gave two characters. I hope this information will be of some help to you.
For question 2, you are right . I did not do much consideration on why there is a relation substituting h with l. I just did it according to my memory about a book that had stated the substitution customs. As I have just started to study Guangzhouhua, though I have interested in it for a very long time, I had not made records about the books and scripts that I had read before. I remembered that the book’s name is somewhat about evolution of sounds of the minor races (可能是,兄弟民族語言演化概略). The writer of that book had given some examples that h will be replaced by l after long vowel copula. Now I cannot recall them and indeed, I personally have not found examples in my own language. I will go to retrieve that book and once I got it I’ll let you know. Although I admit there is not enough evidence for this inference, I still believe that hau4 has been turned to be lau1. Do you think that hau4 would possibly be influenced by 猱?
-
Lisa C
Re: To: Kobo-Daishi & Thomas
Hello!
We're Say Yup not Hakka, but we say "moo" for auntie. I believe the equivalent character in Cantonese is the last part of "bak mo". The relationship would be the same as Cantonese "bak liang". We also use this form of address to any female older than our mothers but too young to be addressed as "hoo" Cantonese equivalent "po". Females younger than our moms would be "seem" Cantonese equivalent of "sum".
(When I say Cantonese I mean Guangdonghua, since I am also Cantonese, but from outside of Guangzhou).
Kobo - I know you're Taishanese do you follow the same rules as I do except for pronounciation? I know some Taishan say "poo" instead of "hoo". I also never know when to use "gu liang" to address someone and "see nai" is just so old sounding.
It's been really interesting reading your notes on monkey.
Lisa
We're Say Yup not Hakka, but we say "moo" for auntie. I believe the equivalent character in Cantonese is the last part of "bak mo". The relationship would be the same as Cantonese "bak liang". We also use this form of address to any female older than our mothers but too young to be addressed as "hoo" Cantonese equivalent "po". Females younger than our moms would be "seem" Cantonese equivalent of "sum".
(When I say Cantonese I mean Guangdonghua, since I am also Cantonese, but from outside of Guangzhou).
Kobo - I know you're Taishanese do you follow the same rules as I do except for pronounciation? I know some Taishan say "poo" instead of "hoo". I also never know when to use "gu liang" to address someone and "see nai" is just so old sounding.
It's been really interesting reading your notes on monkey.
Lisa
-
Terence Lee
Re: To: Kobo-Daishi & Thomas
More information about 母也jie3(pinyin)，
According to Kang Xi Zi Dian, this character 母也is an ancient character for 姐、姊and 女市.
According to Panyu Script (Qing), people of Panyu call step-mother as也母 or 世 也母. At present, Cantonese still call step-mother as sai3 ze2 though often written as 細姐, it is then understandable that 也母should be the same as 母也and they are sounded as ze2 (jyutpin) but not naa2.
There exists in Cantonese a sound naa2 standing for all female animals and even mother, such as 牛 naa2 ‘cow’，雞 naa2. ‘hen’ ，外母 naa2 ‘mother-in-law’. This sound has been put to 也母by the public recognition and even in some newly published dictionaries. However, it is wrong.
According to ‘Dialects and Chinese Culture’, naa2 is a substratum language originally used by the ancient Yue 百越people. Many different minor races had similar sound to address their mothers and female animals. Like these, Zhuang race壯族 addresses ‘aunt 姨母’ as me6na4 while Dai race 傣族 as me6la4. Dan race撣族 calls ‘grandmother-in-law外祖母/阿婆/婆婆’ as na3 while Laos老撾as me6na6 and Black Dai 黑傣 as na:i3. Some ancient books like Bo Ya has recorded that Chu 楚people called mother as 嬭 naai3 (廣韻, 奴蟹切). Now, it is quite possible that naai3 in some dialectal blocks of South China have changed to sound as naa2 and it is justified that Cantonese也母for the sound naa2 should be rectified to be 嬭。
According to Kang Xi Zi Dian, this character 母也is an ancient character for 姐、姊and 女市.
According to Panyu Script (Qing), people of Panyu call step-mother as也母 or 世 也母. At present, Cantonese still call step-mother as sai3 ze2 though often written as 細姐, it is then understandable that 也母should be the same as 母也and they are sounded as ze2 (jyutpin) but not naa2.
There exists in Cantonese a sound naa2 standing for all female animals and even mother, such as 牛 naa2 ‘cow’，雞 naa2. ‘hen’ ，外母 naa2 ‘mother-in-law’. This sound has been put to 也母by the public recognition and even in some newly published dictionaries. However, it is wrong.
According to ‘Dialects and Chinese Culture’, naa2 is a substratum language originally used by the ancient Yue 百越people. Many different minor races had similar sound to address their mothers and female animals. Like these, Zhuang race壯族 addresses ‘aunt 姨母’ as me6na4 while Dai race 傣族 as me6la4. Dan race撣族 calls ‘grandmother-in-law外祖母/阿婆/婆婆’ as na3 while Laos老撾as me6na6 and Black Dai 黑傣 as na:i3. Some ancient books like Bo Ya has recorded that Chu 楚people called mother as 嬭 naai3 (廣韻, 奴蟹切). Now, it is quite possible that naai3 in some dialectal blocks of South China have changed to sound as naa2 and it is justified that Cantonese也母for the sound naa2 should be rectified to be 嬭。
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Terence Lee
Re: To: Kobo-Daishi & Thomas
Additional information about 嬭
The ancient character for 嬭 is 囗with乳inside the square, shown as 囗乳here. 囗乳means ‘乳milk’，a synonym of it is 奶.
There is not 奶in Kang Xi Zi Dian. I believe it is a lately created character derived from 嬭. Xiandai Hanyu Cidian has categorized both 奶and 嬭 to be the same character with different writing forms. Nowadays, Cantonese calling husband’s mother as 奶奶 naai4 naai5, husband’s daughter-in-law as 少奶 siu3 naai1(old saying) whilst people at the common language blocks calling grandma as 奶奶 nai3 nai3, are also from 嬭 since it has many indication to women.
The character ‘母mother’ is a pictogram indicating woman breast (milk producing organ), and it is used to indicate all female animals Naa2嬭is 乳 probably originated from 母 and it indicates all female animals also, i.e. 嬭 is to some extent equal to 母. So there are母牛 = 牛嬭，母雞 = 雞嬭。
The ancient character for 嬭 is 囗with乳inside the square, shown as 囗乳here. 囗乳means ‘乳milk’，a synonym of it is 奶.
There is not 奶in Kang Xi Zi Dian. I believe it is a lately created character derived from 嬭. Xiandai Hanyu Cidian has categorized both 奶and 嬭 to be the same character with different writing forms. Nowadays, Cantonese calling husband’s mother as 奶奶 naai4 naai5, husband’s daughter-in-law as 少奶 siu3 naai1(old saying) whilst people at the common language blocks calling grandma as 奶奶 nai3 nai3, are also from 嬭 since it has many indication to women.
The character ‘母mother’ is a pictogram indicating woman breast (milk producing organ), and it is used to indicate all female animals Naa2嬭is 乳 probably originated from 母 and it indicates all female animals also, i.e. 嬭 is to some extent equal to 母. So there are母牛 = 牛嬭，母雞 = 雞嬭。