Hi Sim,
Hakkas in TW are very mainstream in how they refer to Tnglang: Huaren, Zhongguoren, Tiongkoklang, etc. I think most of them have no qualms about using any of these terms. As Yams, they're much less afraid of being politically incorrect than Taros are, but unlike the Hoklo, they're historically very "pro-Tiongkok", e.g. fighting alongside Qing troops to put down Hoklo anti-Qing uprisings. It would be interesting to know what words they use in Hakka. But Hakka is fading fast in TW. Outside a handful of backroads all-Hakka townships, you'd be hard-pressed to find someone under 45 who could speak fluent Hakka.
You relate more to Green-leaning people? Interesting!
Hi Niuc,
That's quite common among Southern Chinese, I guess. Though Baiyue genes etc in our blood vary from a bit to a lot, nevertheless most think of themselves as pure Han. Having say that, shouldn't the term 唐人 include 百越 already? May be this is why we refer to ourselves as 唐人 instead of 漢人? I wonder how prevalent were mix marriages in Northern Chinese, and how their descendants view themselves now?
I guess there's no reason why it couldn't be included... As I see it, 漢人 vs. 唐人 is a matter of "Southern pride". It's probably no coincidence that the second term is mostly used in Kwongtung and places with lots of Kwongtung-jan.
A lot of the people I meet from north of the Great Wall are part Han, part Mongol or Manchu or Korean blood. Seems like they mostly consider themselves to be "Chinese", but I think something happens when Korean blood approaches one half. They become very conscious of being half Korean or ethnic Korean. Ethnic Koreans from China, when they go to L.A., they join the Korean community, no questions asked. I knew a Han-Mongol girl who grew up in Nagoya. I think she considered herself to be Japanese, but in true Japanese fashion, she refused to talk about these things.
Are you referring to 228 Massacre?
That's the focal point. Also the Pehsek Khiongpou. But the misbehavior continued throughout the time of martial law. Also consider KMT businesses like China Airlines. They regulated the gov't, not the other way around. KMT people controlled every industry in this way. Banking. Loans. It was endlessly "corrupt". No wonder they get nostalgic talking about the martial law days. It's also interesting how much money Chiang Kaishek dumped into building monuments to himself, at a time when TW was a Third World economy. Isn't that the worst kind of "corruption"? But hey, my view doesn't "represent". Most TWese LOVE their dictators.
Beside that, I think their anti-Chinese stance is often ridiculous. One thing I cannot understand though: why should they try so hard to deny everything Chinese in order to be independent?
A vast topic. I agree that THEIR anti-Chinese stance is usually ridiculous. They never defined or tried to understand what "Chinese" is, and what they are in relation to it. They assumed this was irrelevant. They were men and women of the "modern" era. Spiritually, they flowed from the Meiji Restoration. They saw everything in national terms: pissing into the wind, in these times. I guess we can see the same thing elsewhere, in Indonesia, in Thailand, in China, everywhere: distorting history for the sake of the nation. Even "we-had-to-import-our-water" Singapore--never mind the super-strategic location.
Then there's the antagonism btw the ROC and the TW nationalists. "Internationally," the whole dispute is usually framed in PRC vs. ROC terms. People don't realize how vicious the ROC was toward the TW nationalists. That's where the real fight was. The whole ROC/PRC thing was just a charade. Talk to politically-minded Blue-leaning people in TW. They would reconcile with the PRC--the people that flushed them out of China--but they'd never reconcile with the TW nationalists, the people whose nation they prevented. Food for thought. But the ROC isn't the same ROC anymore. There's Green power in the ROC now. That's why Green power sold the nationalist/independence project down the river. And the whole fight is reshaping itself into what the "international community" assumed it was all along.
The TW nationalists were/are Chinese, deep down. They worshipped their ancestors and the Son of Heaven. Their break with other Chinese was that they shifted their allegiance to the Atlantic world. The president of the U.S. became their Son of Heaven. This is why other Chinese are so outraged, esp. Nusantara/M'sian Chinese (for many reasons).
As for why they wanted to do this, it probably had a lot to do with the things they suffered under ROC rule, plus the brainwashing that the Japanese delivered. In their hearts, they wanted to see the Atlantic powers and Japan put a beatdown on the ROC, or the PRC if necessary. This is a lot like educated PRC people always anxious to see their military lay a beatdown on TW, or KMT people hoping that the PRC will lay a beatdown on TW if the TW nationalists get the upper hand.
The VNese rejected China for different reasons: "Let no man hold us under." Maybe someday TW or Kwongtung, etc., will be able to do the same. What it boils down to is a basic attitude in life. In Vietnamese culture, heroes are little people who outsmart and beat back the big people who want to dominate them. In Chinese culture, heroes are big people who beat down little people when the little people want to be free. It's sick.
Is there such a "rule" that there must be only one country for Chinese? IMHO, PRC and ROC are just fine, no matter whether their citizens choose to unite or always stay as two different countries.
I agree. Singapore kind of is another Chinese country. Yet the ROC probably has no reason to exist. But there's powerful vested interests that control the media in TW and tell us how important it is for the ROC to go on. I mean, it's okay for it to exist. Let's just not pretend that that means anything.