Hi Ah-bin,
For years, I believed that in Fujian and Taiwan, Hokkien was pure and people there spoke it at a level way ahead of the Hokkien in Malaysia. It's only in the last 2 years that I've gradually learned that this isn't true, indeed, perhaps even almost the opposite.
I was starting to feel very depressed about your latest account, but then cheered myself up with a new thought: one could see it as a typical case of "is the glass half full or half empty?".
I mean, it may be true that Hokkien is dying out in Fujian and Taiwan (and even there, I still cherish a secret hope that in very rural Fujian and southern Taiwan, it will live on), but the positive note is that (precarious as it is, and also losing ground elsewhere too) at least it's hanging on a bit better in the true overseas communities, like in Malaysia or the Philippines. Perhaps by making Hokkien-speaking Malaysians/Filipinos aware that they might be the last precious centres of this form of Sinitic (as you did in your latest account), we may yet reverse the trend, and cause them to be proud of what Hokkien they can speak.
I am so grateful to people like you and aokh and Mark, who are doing so much to increase awareness about and pride in Hokkien.
Hokkien-Only Policy
Re: Hokkien-Only Policy
Great story.
Kedah/Penang, the great exception.
There's something about that "Oh, my parents spoke to me in Mandarin" line that makes my skin crawl.
龍巖 is Lêngnâ.
Not really in defense of the Lengnite in the story, but ... even if her parents had spoken to her in a Lengna language, chances are she wouldn't've been able to understand Ah-bin's PgHK or even Amoy Hoklo. Lengna Hoklo is heavy on Hakka elements and may be as different from Amoy Hoklo as Teochew is... Also, much of Lengna is Hakkophone, and, AFAIK, Lengna Hakkas don't bother to learn any kind of Hoklo.
The discussion about the "linguistic future" of the human race seems to be picking up steam. There's a strong case that there's not much room for multilingualism in the borderless society that we find ourselves living in more and more.
A lot of us don't wanna believe it, but...
There's a "polyglot community" online now. A lot of their stories were published in THE POLYGLOT PROJECT. Guess how many languages they use to discuss everything? One.
Why do they, or we, even bother to learn "all them other languages"?
Nationalism has been a big experiment in "linguisticide".
When the nations fall apart -- this has already started -- will we just be left with English, Mandarin, Russian, Spanish and Malay?
Kedah/Penang, the great exception.
There's something about that "Oh, my parents spoke to me in Mandarin" line that makes my skin crawl.
龍巖 is Lêngnâ.
Not really in defense of the Lengnite in the story, but ... even if her parents had spoken to her in a Lengna language, chances are she wouldn't've been able to understand Ah-bin's PgHK or even Amoy Hoklo. Lengna Hoklo is heavy on Hakka elements and may be as different from Amoy Hoklo as Teochew is... Also, much of Lengna is Hakkophone, and, AFAIK, Lengna Hakkas don't bother to learn any kind of Hoklo.
The discussion about the "linguistic future" of the human race seems to be picking up steam. There's a strong case that there's not much room for multilingualism in the borderless society that we find ourselves living in more and more.
A lot of us don't wanna believe it, but...
There's a "polyglot community" online now. A lot of their stories were published in THE POLYGLOT PROJECT. Guess how many languages they use to discuss everything? One.
Why do they, or we, even bother to learn "all them other languages"?
Nationalism has been a big experiment in "linguisticide".
When the nations fall apart -- this has already started -- will we just be left with English, Mandarin, Russian, Spanish and Malay?
Re: Hokkien-Only Policy
There are sad signs in the air, even in a language as well established as Dutch...
- At a number of Dutch universities, you can get a degree studying completely in English. As "recently" as the 1980's, you had to reach high-school level Dutch (obviously) before you were allowed to enroll at a Dutch university.
- In our work canteen (admittedly, I work for a multinational, but still...), there used to be signs labelling the food in Dutch and English (useful for the foreign visitors). These days, the labels are very often only in English; under the (correct) assumption that everyone will understand the English labels, so if you're only going to label in one language - to save costs - then it might as well be English.
PS. At my last place of work (more than 12 years ago now), there were two bins in the canteen, labelled (again, only in English) "Food" and "Non-Food" ***. As the Dutch word for "nun" is "Non", there used to be humourous remarks made about the poor nuns who were getting fed the rubbish from our canteen
.
***: These were meant for the "rubbish" at the end of the meal. I suppose the things put into the "food" one could be used for composting or feeding to pigs or whatever, whereas the "non-food" one was for plastic cups, paper wrappings of the sandwiches, cardboard containers for stuff.
- At a number of Dutch universities, you can get a degree studying completely in English. As "recently" as the 1980's, you had to reach high-school level Dutch (obviously) before you were allowed to enroll at a Dutch university.
- In our work canteen (admittedly, I work for a multinational, but still...), there used to be signs labelling the food in Dutch and English (useful for the foreign visitors). These days, the labels are very often only in English; under the (correct) assumption that everyone will understand the English labels, so if you're only going to label in one language - to save costs - then it might as well be English.
PS. At my last place of work (more than 12 years ago now), there were two bins in the canteen, labelled (again, only in English) "Food" and "Non-Food" ***. As the Dutch word for "nun" is "Non", there used to be humourous remarks made about the poor nuns who were getting fed the rubbish from our canteen
.***: These were meant for the "rubbish" at the end of the meal. I suppose the things put into the "food" one could be used for composting or feeding to pigs or whatever, whereas the "non-food" one was for plastic cups, paper wrappings of the sandwiches, cardboard containers for stuff.
Re: Hokkien-Only Policy
Haha, Lú siá án-né-khoán hō∙ wá siāuⁿ chi-lê kò∙-sū….A lot of us don't wanna believe it, but...
There's a "polyglot community" online now. A lot of their stories were published in THE POLYGLOT PROJECT. Guess how many languages they use to discuss everything? One.
Why do they, or we, even bother to learn "all them other languages"?
Wá ē-kì ū chit-táu wá ū chham thák-chhe∙h-lâng ê hōe, ū chi-lê thák-chhe∙h-lâng tít-tít hiâm kóng khah-chē gōa-kok ê hák-chiá bô-siâng-kà i, siá i lâng ê lūn-bûn ták-ták-pái kan-ná iōng Âng-mô∙-ōa lâi siá niā. Pún-lâi há-lê lâng sī giân-kiú Jít-pún ê Ainu-lâng ê lék-su, sī iōng jít-pún-ōa siá míh-kiàⁿ ê. I kóng liáu ê-sî ū lâng mūi i “Nà, Lú hâ-míh-sū bô iōng Ainu ê ōa lâi siá lú ka-kī ê lūn-bûn ni?” Há-lê thák-chhe∙h-lâng tō bô ōa kóng liáu!!!!
Re: Hokkien-Only Policy
Globalization is *fine by me*, along with everyone learning English in order to communicate well with one another. I'm actually a big supporter of this trend. It's just that I want to have my cake and eat it too: I would like more and more people to speak English (well), AND retain their original language(s).
In some way, this has parallels with the "What is Hokkien" / "What is the most desirable form of Hokkien" issue. I'd love for there to be a supra-regional form of Hokkien, so that all Hokkien speakers can communicate easily and well with one another. But at the same time, I'd like the retention of the local varieties - with all their borrowed words and local usages - for the "emotional resonance" and "local colour" that only the languages we learnt as children can give us.
In some way, this has parallels with the "What is Hokkien" / "What is the most desirable form of Hokkien" issue. I'd love for there to be a supra-regional form of Hokkien, so that all Hokkien speakers can communicate easily and well with one another. But at the same time, I'd like the retention of the local varieties - with all their borrowed words and local usages - for the "emotional resonance" and "local colour" that only the languages we learnt as children can give us.
Re: Hokkien-Only Policy
Amhoanna, I also know of 龍巖 as Lîng-nâ, but recently just knew that there are at least two youtube videos from its native speakers who pronounce it as Liông-nâ.
Ah-bin, kám-siā lú ê kò∙-sū!
Sim, I totally agree with you!
Ah-bin, kám-siā lú ê kò∙-sū!
Sim, I totally agree with you!
Re: Hokkien-Only Policy
Hò·ⁿ, nạ sĩ suỉ lảng kọ· suỉ lảng ẻ gứbủn siá lụnbủn chut cokphín, coản sèkài ẻ hạkciá ṃ tọ bián choạ bó· seⁿ kiáⁿ phạⁿ mẹ'á, kui kang kanna chị ẹkchiú (譯手) lui tọ lóng khai liáuliáu ·a? Goá kámka' ánne ... cin cán!...I kóng liáu ê-sî ū lâng mūi i “Nà, Lú hâ-míh-sū bô iōng Ainu ê ōa lâi siá lú ka-kī ê lūn-bûn ni?” Há-lê thák-chhe∙h-lâng tō bô ōa kóng liáu!!!!...