learning Cantonese?!
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余俊
Re: learning Cantonese?!
今天我的心情很糟糕，因为我昨天夜里做一个噩梦，把我给吓醒以后，我再也无法入睡，一直眼睁睁的等到天亮。
Re: learning Cantonese?!
Hi,
I have read all the responses posted to your question and they are all fascinating. My reason is that China and Chinese culture, people, etc. really interest me. I have been studying Mandarin for about one year through tapes, listening to a Chinese language radio station and watching Chinese movies that have become ever more popular in the U.S. I am doing pretty good so far. However, Cantonese is far more widely spoken here in New York City than Mandarin. I would eventually like to be fluent in both, that would be a great accomplishment. I recently purchased some Cantonese tapes. I love the shocked look on a Cantonese speakers face when i even use just a couple of words. My dream is to walk into a Chinese restaurant and speak only whatever Chinese is being spoken.
Hope any of this made sense. Its just fun to speak Chinese! They are great people.
I have read all the responses posted to your question and they are all fascinating. My reason is that China and Chinese culture, people, etc. really interest me. I have been studying Mandarin for about one year through tapes, listening to a Chinese language radio station and watching Chinese movies that have become ever more popular in the U.S. I am doing pretty good so far. However, Cantonese is far more widely spoken here in New York City than Mandarin. I would eventually like to be fluent in both, that would be a great accomplishment. I recently purchased some Cantonese tapes. I love the shocked look on a Cantonese speakers face when i even use just a couple of words. My dream is to walk into a Chinese restaurant and speak only whatever Chinese is being spoken.
Hope any of this made sense. Its just fun to speak Chinese! They are great people.
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susan howard
Re: learning Cantonese?!
Can you tell me why Hong Kong Chinese are so protective of their Cantonese language? Many try to discourage people from learning it.
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Gardenia
Re: learning Cantonese?!
Susan
I know exactly what you mean and I have to say after learning cantonese for so long I come to only one conclusion-a kind of stereotyping of non-chinese boredering on racsim. It seems every Cantonese speaker is convinced only Chinese should speak Chinese and Westerners (no matter what part of europe they are from) speak English. When people act surprised at my chinese ability I simply adopt a blank look and say : "Well, you speak english". I have seen westerners and Indians born and bred in Hong Kong, speak perfect chinese only to have shop assistants and whoever still try to use broken english with them. Wake up!
I know exactly what you mean and I have to say after learning cantonese for so long I come to only one conclusion-a kind of stereotyping of non-chinese boredering on racsim. It seems every Cantonese speaker is convinced only Chinese should speak Chinese and Westerners (no matter what part of europe they are from) speak English. When people act surprised at my chinese ability I simply adopt a blank look and say : "Well, you speak english". I have seen westerners and Indians born and bred in Hong Kong, speak perfect chinese only to have shop assistants and whoever still try to use broken english with them. Wake up!
Re: Protective
Ha ha, this reminds me of one of Larry Feign's early cartoons. A Westerner buys something in HK. The Westerner tries to be nice and talk Cantonese to the shop assistant. The shop assistant tries to be nice and talks English. Both insist. They both end up being very angry that the other did not appreciate his efforts: "Jerk!! Can't he see I'm speaking Cantonese." and "Jerk!! Can't he see I'm speaking English."
I have never seen any other place, where English as a foreign language is so important for your value as an employee, as is the case in HK. We should really excuse a shop assistant, if he is afraid of being seen as speaking insufficient English, may be while his boss is watching the scene.
Still I have to say that the response to my efforts to speak Cantonese to Hongkongers was mostly positive. That includes shop assistants. And rarely someone tried to discourage me from learning it.
And even if they do, there is an obvious explanation. Hongkongers see their language as a mere dialect of standard Chinese. When they write, they write standard Chinese and not Cantonese and writing real Cantonese is considered as low style. Songs are sung in standard Chinese even though with Cantonese pronounciation, because "singing real Cantonese does not sound elegant". And this is true already for children songs and fairy tales, so you can bet that this is deeply rooted in their mind. If someone has so low an opinion of his own language, he will feel that he is really doing a favour to the foreigner by trying to discourage him to learn that stuff.
I think "protective" is a misunderstanding.
I have never seen any other place, where English as a foreign language is so important for your value as an employee, as is the case in HK. We should really excuse a shop assistant, if he is afraid of being seen as speaking insufficient English, may be while his boss is watching the scene.
Still I have to say that the response to my efforts to speak Cantonese to Hongkongers was mostly positive. That includes shop assistants. And rarely someone tried to discourage me from learning it.
And even if they do, there is an obvious explanation. Hongkongers see their language as a mere dialect of standard Chinese. When they write, they write standard Chinese and not Cantonese and writing real Cantonese is considered as low style. Songs are sung in standard Chinese even though with Cantonese pronounciation, because "singing real Cantonese does not sound elegant". And this is true already for children songs and fairy tales, so you can bet that this is deeply rooted in their mind. If someone has so low an opinion of his own language, he will feel that he is really doing a favour to the foreigner by trying to discourage him to learn that stuff.
I think "protective" is a misunderstanding.
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Tom
Re: learning Cantonese?!
Just want to say that it is fantastic if children growing up in bi-/multi lingual families can learn to speak two or more languages fluently. I also believe that the face<>language connection mentioned by James is very important and should be kept in mind.
Many of my friends have grown up speaking only a foreign language at home (Chinese, Vietnamese, Spanish) and manage to learn English just as good as anyone having English as their mother tounge.
At last but not least, I just want to say that I have also been learning Cantonese for several years and hope to be able to speak it fluently some day (soon). As far as reading Chinese is concerned I still have a loooooong way to go - can read and write about 200 characters or so (less than 1% of the minimum neccessary to be able to read and write).
Good luck!!
Many of my friends have grown up speaking only a foreign language at home (Chinese, Vietnamese, Spanish) and manage to learn English just as good as anyone having English as their mother tounge.
At last but not least, I just want to say that I have also been learning Cantonese for several years and hope to be able to speak it fluently some day (soon). As far as reading Chinese is concerned I still have a loooooong way to go - can read and write about 200 characters or so (less than 1% of the minimum neccessary to be able to read and write).
Good luck!!
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chan
Re: learning Cantonese?!
my dream is to speak cantonese/mandarin fluently and read and write up to 3000 characters just enough to read a daily newspaper or something... i love chinese and its history... i've been watching dubbed chinese dramas in my language ever since i was 8 years old and never missed any good chinese dramas yet and now i am 23... its so easy to learn mandarin coz of the sources and classes offered in college thats why i want to start off learning cantonese first... so by the time i reached 30 years old... i should be able to speak fluent chinese... by the way, i'm far from 3000 characters... i'm at 150 now... 2,850 to go... wish me luck!
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keith
Re: learning Cantonese?!
I went to HK in the late 70's to live for the purpose of learning Cantonese. I found the HK people very helpful, always encouraging me to learn more. I have never had any negative experiences with them trying to impede me or discourage me. I returned to Toronto,Canada where I met my present Chinese wife. We have 2 wonderful children and we all speak Cantonese as well as English. I just discovered this site and I thing it is great!!
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Dr_aggie
Re: learning Cantonese?!
Well. it's useful to learn Cantonese.
But for thoses who are just curious about Chinese culture and Chinese language, I would say mandarin is much better for beginners.
Mandarin has 4 tones, Catonese has 9. Mandarin vocabulary covers newspapers and books, many Cantonese words have no really writing forms.
I am a native speaker of Mandarin. When I went to Chinatowns in Los Angeles or Houston for eating and shopping, I spoke mandarin all the time. And EVERYONE UNDESTANDS ME WELL. Now very few Cantonese people do not understand Mandarin. Even in Hong Kong, which had been seperated from Beijing government, Mandarin is understood quite widely now.
Moreover, if you choose to learn Cantonese, you'll see how different the writing language (based on Mandarin) and the oral language (local Cantonese) are!
But for thoses who are just curious about Chinese culture and Chinese language, I would say mandarin is much better for beginners.
Mandarin has 4 tones, Catonese has 9. Mandarin vocabulary covers newspapers and books, many Cantonese words have no really writing forms.
I am a native speaker of Mandarin. When I went to Chinatowns in Los Angeles or Houston for eating and shopping, I spoke mandarin all the time. And EVERYONE UNDESTANDS ME WELL. Now very few Cantonese people do not understand Mandarin. Even in Hong Kong, which had been seperated from Beijing government, Mandarin is understood quite widely now.
Moreover, if you choose to learn Cantonese, you'll see how different the writing language (based on Mandarin) and the oral language (local Cantonese) are!