Although... actually...

Mark Yong · Post by **Mark Yong** » Sun Aug 14, 2005 11:41 am

Hello, everyone!

Apologies for the long leave of absence. Have been really busy juggling work and part-time studies! Just to start my engine running again, here is another of my cryptic topic titles...

A phrase which I seem NEVER to have heard used in Penang Hokkien is 雖然 (Mandarin xu1ran2) or "although / even though". In fact, I don't think I have even heard it used in Minnan in general (though, I have no doubt that it is used regularly in the news on radio, etc... just haven't had the priviliege of catching it used yet!).

Another phrase which I hear more often among 'Southern Hokkien' speakers (Chuan Chew?) is 其實 'k'i sit' or "Actually... /In fact...". For some reason, the Penang Hokkien speakers tend to use 正實 'chia sit' or 實在 'sit cai' instead.

As an aside... is the pronunciation for 然 "lán" or "láen"? I hear the latter more often (as in 自然 "chu láen"), but have, on one occasion, heard it as "chu lán" (the speaker whom I heard it from has left her Hokkien-speaking Penang homeland for a while, so her pronunciation may have been diluted by Mandarin over time).

Cheers,
Mark

PS. For the Penangites on this forum, I read with a mixture of sadness and rage that the Penang Municipal Council has injudiciously demolised half of the Moongate (the archway leading up the jungle trail of Penang Hill). And only after a huge public outcry are they now recanting and considering rebuilding it to the original design. For the observant, there are two words carved on the top of the archway, 泳泝. Any idea of its meaning and/or significance? Using my very basic knowledge of Chinese, I believe it roughly translates into "search for my past" or something like that... not literally, though...

hong · Post by **hong** » Sun Aug 14, 2005 12:10 pm

然 is jian 5 or chiangchiu jian.I did hear taiwanese say 雖罔 sui bong. 正實﹐實在 is real ,really not although.

hong · Post by **hong** » Sun Aug 14, 2005 1:13 pm

sorry,I mistype about although .其實 is in fact,actually.實在﹐正實are actual,very,really﹐concrete.

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Tue Aug 16, 2005 10:13 am

雖然-> sui1 ran2 not xu1 ran2

hong · Post by **hong** » Fri Aug 19, 2005 9:12 am

I have to mention Singapore minnan dict say 芭 (hanzi they give is 山above 巴)may be from malay pabrik.I find one Indonesian dict say it means factory.

Sim · Post by **Sim** » Tue Aug 23, 2005 8:11 am

hong wrote:I have to mention Singapore minnan dict say 芭 (hanzi they give is 山above 巴)may be from malay pabrik.I find one Indonesian dict say it means factory.

Interesting that this is the word for "factory" in Indonesian. I would imagine it's borrowed from Dutch "fabriek" which means factory.

Sim.

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Tue Aug 23, 2005 1:22 pm

岊

岜?
pabrik? (factory?)
What is its realtionship with Although?

hong · Post by **hong** » Tue Aug 23, 2005 2:40 pm

I have no time to search the old topic to post this .Do you know that the question you asked in fact already been answered by me with the article by Prof.Yang in this forum?

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Wed Sep 14, 2005 10:25 am

hong wrote:I have no time to search the old topic to post this .Do you know that the question you asked in fact already been answered by me with the article by Prof.Yang in this forum?

Sorry, i don't know. Short comments is OK.

Mark Yong · Post by **Mark Yong** » Sat Sep 17, 2005 3:52 am

Another set of words I seldom hear in Hokkien: 既然 (Mandarin ji1 ran2), i.e. "since... is so".

By the way, I notice there are two ways of saying "now" in Penang Hokkien: tong kim 當今 and th'an a (? ?). People who use one form rarely use the other. And the latter is often used by the so-called non-Chinese educated.

Mark